Is Communism Fading?

[world_ssr]

It appears that the workers of America today seem content. I think the capitalists of today are wising up to the situation. The offered up all sorts of concessions, like the right to build unions, and protest. During the Cold War, they put up scary pictures of Stalin and Kruschev and yelled "COMMUNISM? BAAAAAAAD!!!!!!!". Then McCarthy scared the pants off the country in his demented quest to destroy communism, and to take power. The labor of today just seem to have lost the will to fight, and now it is left up to us young middle-classers to fight a crusade that was meant to destroy us. I wonder, can we ever come to terms with communism if we reinstate it? Will it just degenerate into a deformed workers state, like North Korea? Did we miss something? Some important part of human nature, that has brought communism down, time and time again? Can this problem ever be fixed? How can I bring back my faith? Someone please reply with some comforting words.

HAPPY MAY DAY, COMRADES!!!

[ckaihatsu]

> It appears that the workers of America today seem content.


This is a very broad generalization -- *too* broad, I think. Sure, the "mainstream" white, predominantly male, middle-class will be more content with the status quo, no matter the era, because they're benefitting from it the most. That *doesn't* mean that *everyone*, or even the majority, is content with current conditions.

Besides the subjective factor of 'contentness' there are also overarching, general conditions to take into account. The *majority* wants troops out of Afghanistan and Iraq. The *majority* does not approve of George Bush. The *majority* has seen record-setting job destruction and polarization of wealth during the Bush Administration.

Today's May Day march in Chicago and other U.S. cities was about immigration, just as it was last year. Immigrant workers are the ones most victimized and dehumanized, if not jailed and/or kicked out of the country altogether. They are certainly *not* content.

Despite superficial appearances of conformity and passivity there can still be undercurrents of dissatisfaction and brewing rebellion. Please keep in mind that the 1960s counter-culture movement sprang up in the midst of an era of national prosperity and widespread conformity.

One has to be careful of which section of the population one is looking at when drawing conclusions. Those who are most content are also those who the system tends to benefit the most. There's a rap song that says "hypocrisy is the greatest luxury", and it's true -- Strom Thurmond comes to mind as an archetype, or an illustration of that phrase.

Thurmond lived to the age of 100, and, as a professional racist, he held office for almost 50 years! He was a segregationist despite having a maid of color as his lover when in his youth -- *and* she kept her mouth shut until he passed away!


> I think the capitalists of today are wising up to the situation. The offered up all sorts of concessions, like the right to build unions, and protest. During the Cold War, they put up scary pictures of Stalin and Kruschev and yelled "COMMUNISM? BAAAAAAAD!!!!!!!". Then McCarthy scared the pants off the country in his demented quest to destroy communism, and to take power.


*What* situation do you mean? (You said that today's workers are "content.")

The grandest of criminals always need a boogeyman in order to perpetuate their own cover story, or mythology -- today's politicians look back at the Cold War wistfully because >>> it worked! <<< As you rightfully point out, McCarthyism and its legacy were very effective, and demonizing the relatively underdeveloped U.S.S.R. really helped the U.S. ruling class look legitimate as they sat in power.

(Note: "[The] socialist internationalist perspective was betrayed by the Stalinist bureaucracy, which developed in the Soviet state due to the country’s economic backwardness and political isolation. The bureaucracy rejected the course of international revolution and, by the mid-1920s, adopted the reactionary national reformist theory of “socialism in one country.” It initiated a policy of collaboration with world imperialism and the suppression of revolutionary movements throughout the world." http://wsws.org/articles/2007/apr2007/russ-a26.shtml)


> The labor of today just seem to have lost the will to fight, and now it is left up to us young middle-classers to fight a crusade that was meant to destroy us. I wonder, can we ever come to terms with communism if we reinstate it?


I think you're confusing Communism (as in the _Communist Manifesto_) with Stalinism. It's a common mistake, and is mostly due to the successful McCarthyist propaganda which continues to cause misunderstandings to this day. Today's labor struggles may be fairly dissipated, but they are going on every day and many are very militant. If you look for them you'll find them.


> Will it just degenerate into a deformed workers state, like North Korea? Did we miss something? Some important part of human nature, that has brought communism down, time and time again? Can this problem ever be fixed? How can I bring back my faith? Someone please reply with some comforting words.


Nothing about humanity is inevitable -- we can identify trends, whether for labor or capital, but using the explanation of "human nature" is just as vague as saying, "Well, it happened because people talked about it."

The comfort here is that the class struggle has nothing to do with faith -- it is about the majority of the earth's population deciding to run the means of mass production for themselves, instead of continuing to leave matters to the wastefulness of the markets and imperialist wars.


> HAPPY MAY DAY, COMRADES!!!


You, too!



Chris



--

___

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[fire_mat99]

The USA has slaughtered the image of Communism and releases lies, misleading information to its public.

It feels (despite what I see here) like everywhere here in the USA, and other places too: That the ideas of Commuism has drifted out of view. It feels as if Communism has been made to be a thing of the past. Is it fading away?

There seems to be big anti-left movement in US and most people don't understand Communism at all ..

The USA Government portrays communism as having already been defeated, a thing of the 20th Century. I have doubts as to wether I will see a Soviet America, or better yet an entirely Communist world, before I will die. Maybe it will eventually fade out of view and Capitalism will continue to dominate. What are your opinions/facts? Are the number of Communists in our world decreasing?

The only country I see a potential is in south america.Remember this a revolution comes  from extreme harsh condition a reform comes from faulty condition .

The imperialists cannot ultimately prevent the socialist movement; no CIA can control the minds of the masses; no capitalist coercion can oust a group of oppressed individuals.

They can control by propaganda and lies ..

Communism was never really welcomed in America, and its slandered image is still attack as the menace from the past by the US government. However, this reflects only the one Western power - rightist propaganda in Washington is not far-felt throughout the world, and the imposition of the US foreign policy is not willingly obeyed...

The propaganda and lies is one reason and there is big middle class.Not like other countries just the dream of the middle class is paradise.


I do not know what you mean by and the imposition of the US foreign policy is not willingly obeyed the US people are very right they are not left and hate communist.

People in my school found out I'm communist and they got mad at me and said "You want to take over America?" and "You don't believe in democracy?" and some guy went on and on about how the USSR became communist for greater economic power and he kept saying "Communism will never work!". I explained it to them and now I know  Catholics that want to learn more about Communism and start a club.

It is up to you and other communist to explain what is communism all about to the disinform people .

They thought  that Communism was where the rich take advantage of the poor and Capitalism was where everything was distributed equally. I've also met people who think the Democrats represent the poor and middleclass and the republicans represent the upper class. They both represent the upper class. Historically those who represent the bourgeoisie interests thought they represent the interests of everyone.

It is because China and North Korea also the USSR that gives communism a bad name .They think you communist and support a China , North Korea or  USSR style.
 

However thats not what they want people to think, I mean honestly when you look at it, we have a hard time today because the social atmosphere of the united states is mixed between those who have advanced through the years and take good note of what happens ot the country. then there is the majority in which is a cest pool of apathy.

The US has big middle class and they do not want to give up their money to the poor.

I mean for christ sake, we have a video of Bush being preps for Katrina...before it hit! We have the 9/11 reports, we have new evidence that Bush had planned to start the war with Iraq regardless of the lack of WMDs. The war was planned monthes ahead, and yet...some people still like him.

It is the far right they like and the theocracy they like. So even if they don’t like him he is all they got. They like the far right, anti-left, anti-communist, anti-welfare state, theocracy and godlike country, anti-godless, big army, big superpower, imperialistic, anti- gays and lesbian, anti-abortion and stem cell research ,anti-tax , anti-social programs so on.

 

However if we really look at it, this si jsut setting the stage, the people now get to see the problems first hand, now its up to us to spread the knowledge of the soultion. Now we do need an updated manifesto as some points of communism are outdated and need to be reevaluated. However I'm a writer (poor grammer and spelling on a message board doesn't seem to indicate this now does it?)

The middle class are happy with the US system. It is the minority who gets the beating of the system.

I will attempt this when I become more knowledgeable, I know alot about Communism I've read alot of material, but I haven't finish the Mannifesto itself because my dog literally ate the book because he was working for corperate america...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Communist_Manifesto

And they’re many other sites.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marxist_philosophy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bourgeoisie
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophy_in_the_Soviet_Union

Anyways. Have faith and do your part is the best anyone can tell you, its harder for someone who lives in the bible belt as there seems to be no room for socialism here, but I seek to overcome this with writing which will go to all parts of the country. I do think we need a bit of life breathed into us though, ya know a mass education program, free copies of the mannifesto and other selected works (how much sense does it make to sell a copy of communist literature anyways?) I admit I am a bit pessimistic I see the new revolutionary who shows up for the revolutin saying "hey can we go ahead and do this revolution thing already, I've got to get home for dinner." Just hold fast I suppose, our day will come

You writing a book?

[Zatoichi]

Communism is not fading nor is Socialism, simply Capitalism IS NOT DONE yet. Lenin was mistaken when he said that History needs a push, it does NOT. When global control has been established and the Working Class are further oppressed Socialism will resurge in popularity. Give it 150 years Comrades.

[paul r]

Green

When someone says to you "Communism will never work" You could point out the following,

After hundreds of years of capitalism and the creation (by the working class) of unprecedented levels of wealth, 2 out of 3 people on this planet live in poverty, 1 million children and babies die every year because they don't have clean water to drink, many millions more die every year from easily preventable diseases, many undeveloped countries are on the point of collapse because of the superexploitation of the imperialist nations, interminable wars rage on almost every continent and there has hardly been a day of worlwide peace for over a hundred years.

The simple fact is that "Capitalism just doesn't work!" and I think it's time that socialists shouted this fact from the rooftops.

As for a soviet america, the american working class is probably the most educated working class on the planet, they have a fine revolutionary tradition and as the recession bites they will rediscover this tradition rapidly.

The only way that communism could fade away would be if capitalism could solve its problems by providing a good and consistent standard of living for everyone on the planet. As booms and slumps are inherent in capitalism this is impossible therefore there will always be people struggling for a better world as long as capitalism remains in place.

[OUTOFTHENIGHT]

Zatoichi

Communism is not fading nor is Socialism, simply Capitalism IS NOT DONE yet. Lenin was mistaken when he said that History needs a push, it does NOT. When global control has been established and the Working Class are further oppressed Socialism will resurge in popularity. Give it 150 years Comrades.

Phew. Im relieved  by that. If its going to happen in 150 years then I dont have to do anything now. I can get back to work knowing that future generations have the responsibility of bringing in socialism!!!

[fire_mat99]

Zatoichi

Communism is not fading nor is Socialism, simply Capitalism IS NOT DONE yet. Lenin was mistaken when he said that History needs a push, it does NOT. When global control has been established and the Working Class are further oppressed Socialism will resurge in popularity. Give it 150 years Comrades.

Phew. Im relieved  by that. If its going to happen in 150 years then I dont have to do anything now. I can get back to work knowing that future generations have the responsibility of bringing in socialism!!!

I don't think the US will even last 20 years from now to other major depression like the 30's.The US econmany is not good now  and the middle class being removed.

[fire_mat99]

It appears that the workers of America today seem content. I think the capitalists of today are wising up to the situation. The offered up all sorts of concessions, like the right to build unions, and protest. During the Cold War, they put up scary pictures of Stalin and Kruschev and yelled "COMMUNISM? BAAAAAAAD!!!!!!!". Then McCarthy scared the pants off the country in his demented quest to destroy communism, and to take power. The labor of today just seem to have lost the will to fight, and now it is left up to us young middle-classers to fight a crusade that was meant to destroy us. I wonder, can we ever come to terms with communism if we reinstate it? Will it just degenerate into a deformed workers state, like North Korea? Did we miss something? Some important part of human nature, that has brought communism down, time and time again? Can this problem ever be fixed? How can I bring back my faith? Someone please reply with some comforting words.

HAPPY MAY DAY, COMRADES!!!

There are some problems the communist manifesto has not talk about.

1.capitalists just paying anough to keep them quite and stop the unions
2.US and fascism propaganda
3.US ultra conservative
4.State capitalism like USSR  and China
5.deformed workers state
6 government bureaucracy
7.mixed communism
 
 

[OUTOFTHENIGHT]

Hey Fire_matt99

There are some problems the communist manifesto has not talk about.

1.capitalists just paying anough to keep them quite and stop the unions
2.US and fascism propaganda
3.US ultra conservative
4.State capitalism like USSR  and China
5.deformed workers state
6 government bureaucracy
7.mixed communism
 

thats probably because it was written in 1848.

[paul r]

"Is Communism fading"?

A more pertinent question is "Is Capitalism fading"?

The world seems to be on the brink of an economic collapse as great as that of the 1920/30's. And that resulted in a capitalist world war.

The capitalist's banking system seems to be tottering on the edge.

Once the recession bites we can expect all the nationalist wars to increase; Northern Ireland, the Balkans, Kashmir,The middle east,Chechnya, Sri Lanka, Indonesia, not to mention Africa and S America, the list of wars and the deaths and suffering of ordinary people under capitalism is almost endless.

The bosses worldwide will try to shift the burden of their recession on to our shoulders with mass unemployment, attacks on welfare benefits, inflation and all the other tricks they use to protect their own living standards at our expense.

The development of nuclear bombs means that for the first time in history the ruling class  has the technology to destroy the environmental conditions necessary to maintain civilisation if not  human life itself. This ability to destroy human civilisation means that the bourgeousie is now the Doomsday Class, the only class in  history that can destroy world civilisation.

Meanwhile, their lust for short term profits drives the ecology of the planet ever more closer to the point of no return.

Is Communism Fading? I don't think so, in fact, as every day goes by and we witness the Death Agony Of Capitalism more and more clearly it becomes increasingly obvious that Communism has never been as relevant and necessary as it is today.

Either we fight for communism or we allow human civilisation to be destroyed. There really is no alternative.

[fire_mat99]

"Is Communism fading"?

A more pertinent question is "Is Capitalism fading"?

I think the poster is from the US or Canada so looks at it different.They are imperialism and  that is why they have a high living standard.So if you in Canada or the US you feel comfortable other than the 15% in poverty.They are imperialism and exploit other countries for there living standard.

The world seems to be on the brink of an economic collapse as great as that of the 1920/30's. And that resulted in a capitalist world war.

The US is in a little recession now.

The capitalist's banking system seems to be tottering on the edge.

Thast is true in the US.

Once the recession bites we can expect all the nationalist wars to increase; Northern Ireland, the Balkans, Kashmir,The middle east,Chechnya, Sri Lanka, Indonesia, not to mention Africa and S America, the list of wars and the deaths and suffering of ordinary people under capitalism is almost endless.

Sorry I'm not up on what is going on there.Do you have any web sites that explain what is going on?

The bosses worldwide will try to shift the burden of their recession on to our shoulders with mass unemployment, attacks on welfare benefits, inflation and all the other tricks they use to protect their own living standards at our expense.

I think you are trying to say bosses worldwide will try to blame the problem on unemployment ,welfare ,inflation to protect their own living standards .

[Christopher Hill]

To me it seems we are sadly shifting rightwards (Americans) mostly because of the propaganda campaigns connected to 9/11 and the delusion that the Stalinist Bureaucracy is representative of Communism. To me it seems that people, not just on the right are actually in some ways becoming fascist, but rather than race-based it is more on the line of religious fascism. "Those who are not Christian hate Jesus and want to hurt us for being Christian" much of this I would have to blame on people listening to all they hear from religious people, too many fundamentalists are in places of religious authority, and as such they preach these ideas to the youth.. who thinking it is wrong to doubt the "word of god" become thoroughly brainwashed.

[Paula Marx]

It's not fading. Don't you be nostalgic, that's regressive  We have to fight for the future, not to look back in the past! There will always be revolutionaries - true ideologies will never die.
Capitalism isn't fading because it never really existed - it's just an anarchic evil from West which causes politics in USA and distorted internationalism in Europe.

I don't know what would I rather choose - Eastern primitivism or Western Capitalism. At the end, CAPITALISM=PRIMITIVISM. PRIMITIVISM=CAPITALISM!

[Jimi4444]

Interesting topic, which to really understand you have to look at it through a dialectical materialist stance. Through out history we have always had opposing classes and with this different interests. The interests of the ruling class and the poor. Right now we live under capitalist property relations, with the capitalist and the working class. So the worker creates the wealth and gets a little bit of the wealth, while the capitalist gets most. Problem is the fight over who gets that surplus value. Both the capitalist and the workers want it and out of that comes the class struggle, which means that there will inevitably be class conflicts. For a while (at least in the States) the ruling class has been able to kick enough crumbs down to the working class, to make it a relatively peaceful co-existence for a bit. With the end of the post war boom and capitalism in senile decay, they just won't be able to do that anymore (let alone in third world countries!).

Thing is we need a revolutionary party with the means to actually overthrow capitalism, like the Bolsheviks in Russia. That is currently the most important task of Marxist, building the cadre organization. With that when there is a vacuum to fill, we can be there. Right now socialism is on the agenda in a lot of countries, all over Latin America and even western society. We need to work with these organizations to explain to the workers who still have illusions in such parties.

Also some comrades said things that I don't personally agree with. After 9/11 there was a lot of reaction here in the US, that I'm not going to argue with. But the mood has changed incredibly, just look at the election of Barrack Obama. Though obviously Obama isn't progressive in any stretch of the imagination. People still came out in numbers for "change" against the old status quo. Which is a clear indication that the working class was moving right. Now with Obama not doing anything fundamentally different then Bush, and a lack of an alternative a lot of people are confused. Also comrade Josh wrote a very good article on Christianity in the States a little while back. He explained how actually the number of Christians in the country has gone down, along with the right wing fundamentalists and that Atheism went up (this is from the 80s).

[fire_mat99]

To me it seems we are sadly shifting rightwards (Americans) mostly because of the propaganda campaigns connected to 9/11 and the delusion that the Stalinist Bureaucracy is representative of Communism. To me it seems that people, not just on the right are actually in some ways becoming fascist, but rather than race-based it is more on the line of religious fascism. "Those who are not Christian hate Jesus and want to hurt us for being Christian" much of this I would have to blame on people listening to all they hear from religious people, too many fundamentalists are in places of religious authority, and as such they preach these ideas to the youth.. who thinking it is wrong to doubt the "word of god" become thoroughly brainwashed.

The US has never been left country like France ,Venezuela or Australia. And the US has always been very much hard core Christian. Not even center right wing country like Canada.