Ignorance of the Capitalists

[Volkov]

I have noticed ignorance of the US-style Captialists (due to taxes, there is no such thing as pure Captitalism):  they think that Communism is Stalinism.  They then, even when you point out the differences, still call Stalinism Communism.  I have also noticed that they are hypocrites;  when the tried to use proof against me in arguments on other message boards, I looked at their evidence.  Most of them accuse me of not using evidence, but at the same time, they never use evidence to begin with.  Then, when I do use evidence and post citations, they don't even read them and they still say that I am not using proof.  What other trends have you noticed in these messed up people?

[Patt]

Well, George W. uses the tired old "They hate freedom" agurment when talking about our genocidal wars against 2 helpless mid Eastern countries. And they still invoke Adam Smith when pointing out how successful the economy is, even though Smith explicitly said in his On the wealth of nations that the government should have no interfearance in the promotion of the economy. One day i'd love to question W. on how conserative economics works, he'd be clueless.

[turnoviseous]

Dear comrade Volkov,

This is not really a new thing. Rulling classes will always try to destroy their biggest enemy with lies and slanders and when these won´t be enough, when these ideas will be "materialised", they will start using weapons. This is almost like a historical rule.

[Volkov]

Originally posted by turnoviseous
Dear comrade Volkov,

This is not really a new thing. Rulling classes will always try to destroy their biggest enemy with lies and slanders and when these won´t be enough, when these ideas will be "materialised", they will start using weapons. This is almost like a historical rule.

Yes, Comrade, it is not a new thing, but I wanted to discuss the problems and ignorance of supporters of the status quo (current situation).  The problem is that these lies tend to work, and there are many out there who have been tricked into thinking that status quo Captialism is the most fair system out there.

May all Proletarians of the planet unite against the Bourgeoisie when the ruling classes start using weapons and increased aggression.  :)

[JosephV]

On many 'anti-communist' web sites I have noted that they always have some kind of "Death Tally" that shows how many people have died under communism, compared to Hitler etc. One site challenged people to think of a bigger mass murderer than communism, so I emailed the webmaster and not only tried to point out what he was talking about was stalinism, but told him that every death from hunger, poverty, war, cureable disease and racism is because of capaitalism.

Of course, these deaths are for "freedom", and sometimes "freedom" isn't pretty.

The well thought out site is:

http://www.niagara.com/~freedom/anticom/first.htm

Don't take it too seriously, as it holds brilliant lines such as this

"Soviet Russia is alive and well. The "reforms" in the Soviet Union are merely a deception"

.......:rolleyes:

[turnoviseous]

Hey JosephV,

I have already seen the site. I would rank this site as the worst "anti-communist" site. It tries to say so much, but says nothing at all. the main conclusion of the site is "communism has killed people - communism failed - so it is bad".

Here is a nice quote from the site :) :

Citizens of free societies have been lulled into a false security. they are repeatedly told communism is dead, it is splintered and disorganized. In reality, International Communists are hard at work laying the groundwork for their International Communist Revolution. If they succeed in their long term plans, freedom will be lost without a shot being fired.

Now this is really paying too much lip service to us. "Without a shot being fired", isn´t this just nice? :)

[Patt]

Damn commies and their evil machinations!

Conservative Intellectual? Isn't that an oxymoron?

[Volkov]

Originally posted by Patt
Damn commies and their evil machinations!

Conservative Intellectual? Isn't that an oxymoron?

Conservative intellectual?  I didn't say anything about that.  Who said that?

[Patt]

Nononononono, that's my catchphrase :-D See, most conservatives are ranting and raving reactionaries who spend all day talking about America's moral decline and then go start wars.

Conservative Intellectual? Isn't that an oxymoron?

[Patt]

Ohhh, and the nut case on the anti-communism site says that he doesn't wanna leave any sites out, someone should email him our site:p

[Volkov]

Originally posted by Patt
Ohhh, and the nut case on the anti-communism site says that he doesn't wanna leave any sites out, someone should email him our site:p

That would backfire, sadly;  they would just come here and flame and spam us.  Believe me, I have tried to convince Capitalists to Marxism's superiorities on other boards, and I posted evidence as well.  And no matter what you do and how much proof you use, they just stick to the points you have already refuted.  Those people I have tried to convince, or at least educate about Marxism's definitions and purposes have the intelligence capalilities not unlike those of a brick.

Oh, that is your catchphrase, sorry about that.  I guess it is somewhat like your signature.

[Grave Disorder]

It is impossible to convince people of something through reason. Reason is flexible and is ultimately used as a way of justifying someone's gut feeling. The only way is to change someone's values or make them see those aspects of a system which they advocate which go against their professed values. Of course, if you do this you will be accused of emotivism and backing away from rational debate, and the facts you use will be disputed.
 In short, it is impossible to convince capitalists to grow a conscience except through intensive social engineering...

[Volkov]

Originally posted by Grave Disorder
It is impossible to convince people of something through reason. Reason is flexible and is ultimately used as a way of justifying someone's gut feeling. The only way is to change someone's values or make them see those aspects of a system which they advocate which go against their professed values. Of course, if you do this you will be accused of emotivism and backing away from rational debate, and the facts you use will be disputed.
 In short, it is impossible to convince capitalists to grow a conscience except through intensive social engineering...

Damn, it is not easy convincing people these days.

[turnoviseous]

Capitalists can´t really be convinced into socialism through rational arguments or practical examples. This is a nice historical fact which 19 century gave us with the praxis and results of utopian socialism.

You should check out Engels´s book Socialism - Utopian and Scientific: http://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1880/soc-utop/index.htm

[tidybutt]

Anti Communist Action... Sounds like the free market anarchists have got together with libertarian capitalists...

But seriously, one thing to learn from this is the seriousness of their language.  They might sound like the scrivlings of a madman, but whilst capitalism is unable to solve its own crises, ie. until the next stage of the international socialist revolution, the percieved threat of "communism" will be always held up by the bourgeios and their foaming lackeys, as the inevitable consequence of the socialisation of production, and workers democracy......