The SSP - is the adventure in its death agonies?

[strawbs]

Hi again comrades - now that the general election is over  the hard work towards acheiving socialism  in Britain continues, not only for socialists within new labour but those also struggling in alternative sociliast  parties and especially  for the brave but doomed Scottish Socialist Party. I say this with no joy whatsever and without any gloating on their dismal performance in Scotland where they, to their supreme credit, put up candidates in every constituency but failed to acheive any more than 5% of the vote ( outside Glasgow the average was around 2.5%.)  The perspective for the Scottish Parliament elections in two years are a bit better but not much!I have just visited the SSP youth forum and naturally the posts on the subject make sad reading.   Colin Fox appeared on TV yesterday putting a brave face on the showing and I agreed with his analysis of why the main parties outside  acheived the protest vote against new labour instead of the SSP whose programme, although radical was not as bold as it could have been. Might as well be hung for a sheep than a lamb I say and sow the seeds for the future.I would urge all young comrades struggling with the contradiction of mass discontent with new labour with the fact (yes fact) that they managed to get in again,to visit the posts  preceding the election that dealt with this issue. Also to visit the marxist.com article by Phil Michinson. His analysis and perspective is not a pancea but a guide to action for all  socialists who may be thinking about giving up their tiny parties  and groups( including  Respect and George Galloway and the Independents) and joining the LP  proper - maybe not tommorrow or next month but at least before the next election.  - Forward to Socialism.

[OUTOFTHENIGHT]

Orkney & Shetland  John Aberdein 5.6
Glasgow South West  Keith Baldassara 5.4
Dunbartonshire West Les Robertson 4.1
Glasgow Central Marie Gordon 4.0
Glasgow North Nick Tarlton 3.8
Glasgow East George Savage 3.5
Glasgow South Ronnie Stevenson 3.4
Glasgow North West Anthea Irwin 3.3
Cumbernauld, Kilsyth & Kirkintilloch East Willie O'Neill 2.9
Coatbridge, Chryston & Bellshill Joan Kinloch 2.7
Motherwell & Wishaw Gregor MacEwan 2.7
Rutherglen & Hamilton West Bill Bonnar 2.7
Dundee West Jim McFarlane 2.7


The figures represent percentage of vote . I cant find the actual full results yet.

[strawbs]

Stirling 1.05
Falkirk 1.83
Lanark 1.84
Hamilton 2.75
East Lothian 1.10
Edinburgh South .97

For further  results if you are that interested: type in Scotsman in the search engine and follow the links ( the Scotsman is a newspaper) By the way the Scottish Nats ( the SNP) gained three seats  This is a party that the SSP wish to link up with in their desire for a Scottish Socialist Republic ( nationalism by a fancy title) Does this demonstrate that if someone wanted to vote for a nationalist Scotland then he or she would go for the party whose main aim was nationalism  ( whilst still retaining the total structure of capatilism) i nstead of the halfway house that the SSP is putting forward ( halfway house in the way of part nationalisation  and part.. sort of co-ops..  and social enterprise through  a popular front with the SNP and the Greens?)

[strawbs]

Stirling 1.05
Falkirk 1.83
Lanark 1.84
Hamilton 2.75
East Lothian 1.10
Edinburgh South .97

For further  results if you are that interested: type in Scotsman in the search engine and follow the links ( the Scotsman is a newspaper) By the way the Scottish Nats ( the SNP) gained three seats  This is a party that the SSP wish to link up with in their desire for a Scottish Socialist Republic ( nationalism by a fancy title) Does this demonstrate that if someone wanted to vote for a nationalist Scotland then he or she would go for the party whose main aim was nationalism  ( whilst still retaining the total structure of capatilism) i nstead of the halfway house that the SSP is putting forward ( halfway house in the way of part nationalisation  and part.. sort of co-ops..  and social enterprise through  a popular front with the SNP and the Greens?)

[Andy Bowden]

Aye comrades, I'm a member of the SSP and it was a shit result, but don't forget that this is westminster where there was never any chance of Socialists winning a seat and everyone knew it.
The Scottish parliament is far more favourable ground for us - Labour can't give us the old shite about "if you don't vote Labour the Tories will eat your kids etc", and the PR system is a far more fair way of electing representatives than the Westminster dominance with only a minority support.
Besides, Westminster is in the past. Recent polls show more Scots want independence than oppose it - Scotland will be independent in the next 10 - 15 years and the SSP can build itself in a PR election system in Scotland.

[OUTOFTHENIGHT]

Hi Andy
Colin Fox or Tommy Sheridan?
Who is the figurehead of the SSP?
Who do the Scottish working class associate with the SSP?
May explain the rubbish results the SSP got. Was the dumping of Tommy a mistake??

[salvador segui]

Hi Andy,

Just one little question, what makes you think (or and say) that the majority of Scottish people want independence?

I mean the tradition, as far as I know, is not a strong nationalist movement (like in the Basque Country for instance or Flemish in Belgium). Is more a very strong Labour tradition, and I mean the movement not the party.

Yours,

pablo

[ckaihatsu]

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2005/apr2005/ssp2-a25.shtml

An exchange on the nationalism of the Scottish Socialist Party

By Chris Marsden
25 April 2005

The following e-mail was sent in response to the Socialist Equality Party of Britain’s statement, “The British working class and the 2005 General Election.” It is followed by a reply written by Chris Marsden, the British SEP’s national secretary.

Your article featuring the statement by the Socialist Equality Party (Britain) regarding the General Election 2005 was spoiled only by its complete misrepresentation of the Scottish Socialist Party. Although we stand on a platform calling for independence, we are NOT “nationalist.” We are the only party in Scotland that offers any alternative to capitalism! Why, oh why, can’t parties of the left work together rather than going for each other’s throats all the time? If we can achieve change—no matter how small—does that not benefit the working class and lead them towards expecting, and demanding, more? I think sometimes that the fight for socialism is treated like one big playground game—where the insults fly and nobody actually does anything! I joined the Scottish Socialist Party because at last I found a party that wanted to really do something—not just play the game! It’s hard enough for us to be fighting Tories—be they Labour, Liberal Democrats, Conservative or Scottish Nationalists—without having to watch our backs for people who are supposed to be fellow socialists! As we say in Scotland: Gie’s a break!

N. A.
Scotland

***

Dear Ms A.,

The appraisal we have made of the Scottish Socialist Party is a political one, far removed from the sectarian hurling of epithets. We have defined the SSP as nationalist not because we wish to insult it, but because this constitutes the essential basis of the party’s programmatic foundations.

Indeed, there is an element of political blindness in your own refusal to acknowledge the SSP’s nationalism. Given the overt and repeated insistence of the party that its main aim is to secure an independent Scotland, whether socialist or not, to accept its espousal of various reformist measures and its rhetorical commitment to socialism as good coin requires either a suspension of critical faculties or an acceptance of the SSP’s outlook.

For the benefit of yourself and our readers, it is necessary to review how we analysed the founding of the SSP and its policies.

The SSP was set up in September 1998 at the initiative of the Scottish Militant Labour group (SML), led by Tommy Sheridan. To do so, the SML wound up the Scottish Socialist Alliance, an umbrella organisation of middle-class radicals, ex-Labourites and Stalinists, and broke politically with its English parent group, the Socialist Party, and the Socialist Party’s international body, the Committee for a Workers International (CWI).

The SML argued that its standing in Scotland meant that continued affiliation to the CWI was no longer necessary, and that the more militant and politically advanced Scottish working class should not be forced to wait on their more backward and conservative brothers and sisters south of the border. Instead, the newly formed Scottish Socialist Party would fight to establish a Scottish Socialist Republic as a beacon that others could look to. This would at the same time break up the British nation state, which, it insisted, could only be a progressive development.

That the SSP was, in fact, writing off any possibility of a united struggle of the British, Scottish and international working class counted for little in its political calculations.

[...]

[strawbs]

Trotsky gives a clear explanation of the aims of a transitional programme in acheiving socialism but warns of the dangers of sinking fundemental differences for the sake of acheiving a common goal, and especially and importantly in transforming society through revolution. Fundemental differences,for example, the national question, must be resolved through discussion and debate as in the example of the menshevik v bolshevik and the social revolutionaries and other v bolsheviks  and of course the crucial  issue of Stalinism v Troskyism. Otherwise the ideals of the revolution can end up in disaster, death at worst or  a deformed workers state, facism or stalisim. Thus the debate  of how socialism can be acheived is not merely an acedemic but one  of life and death as history demonstrates. The road to socialism  for the SSP through an alliance with the capitalist parties of the SNP and the Greens is frought with dangers for the SSP even although they wish to court the best elements of those parties. If those in the SSP who want 'left alane' think that they are having a hard time from the likes of myself who happens to beleive that only labour can defeat new labour and Blairetc within the party then how do they think that they would be able to handle their island of socialism within a sea of capitalism in alliance with those who  detest even the mention of the word? -  We are all better of for the SSP unfortunately the adventure is nearly at an end. Its only a matter of time so join us now! Forward to socialism.

[Andy Bowden]

Tommy Sheridan was the national convener of the SSP, now it is Colin Fox so Colin is the new "figurehead".
The bad publicity we recieved after Tommy's resignation may have had an effect on the poor vote, but I personally think the vote would not have been much better if Tommy was still convener.
Examine the SNP who brought back Alex Salmond - a formidable orator and one of Scotlands more charismatic and trusted politicians, when John Swinney - seen as more of an accountant than a politician - there vote still fell despite the return of a better politival operator. So I don't think leaders of parties necessarily save them.
On the issue of Scottish Independence, more people support independence than are opposed to it - although still not a majority as of yet. But when the poll asked the youth their opinions on independence, two thirds supported independence - promising reading for Scottish republicans!
The introduction of PR in local govt also means the SSP should get a significant prescence on Glasgow council (amongst others). So I am still optimistic, the SSP is far from "dead", we will be the party that gets recruits from the anti-g8 protests and the Public sector pensions strike.
Also, the SSP has never entered, or ever will an alliance with Greens or the SNP. We will work with them on issues we have in common, and in drafting an interim constitution for an Independent Scotland, but we stand candidates against the SNP and Greens without exception.

[OUTOFTHENIGHT]

Here is an upate on the financial situation of the SSP. From todays BBC news site.

 
 
Debt-hit SSP faces watchdog wrath  
 
The SSP has missed two deadlines to submit its accounts
The debt-hit Scottish Socialist Party faces a hefty fine or possible police action for failing to submit its accounts to a financial watchdog.
Independent scrutinisers the Electoral Commission confirmed that the SSP had failed to meet the mandatory requirement set by the UK Parliament.

It can either fine the SSP up to £5,000 or call in the police to investigate.

The party said it had asked the commission for more time and it was confident of meeting a new deadline.

Under the Political Parties Elections and Referendums Act, all registered parties must submit accounts to the commission for scrutiny.

Parties spending less than £250,000 were required to have account details in by 31 March, while parties spending more than £250,000 had to have them in by 7 July.

'Good faith'

The SSP, which was due to submit its accounts by July, had asked for an extension to 4 August which the commission said was "granted in good faith".

However, the party has since missed that deadline.

A spokeswoman for the commission revealed that the SSP had again submitted a request asking for an extension.

  We will wait until we receive the accounts before deciding what action to take against the party

Electoral Commission spokeswoman

But she told BBC Scotland's news website that this further request had been turned down.

Ex-leader and current SSP MSP, Tommy Sheridan, said the delay was not a "debt problem or a political problem, but an administrative problem".

He explained: "We have limited staff who work very hard.

"Recently they have had the general election and the G8, which they were embroiled in."

Financial blow

Mr Sheridan said that the commission had previously been very understanding of the party's situation, given its size and age.

He added that he was confident the accounts would be in this month.

 
A total of four out of the six SSP MSPs were banned from parliament
The commission's spokeswoman said it was vital that the party discussed with the watchdog why it had missed a second deadline.

She explained: "The original extension was granted in good faith and we expected the party to have submitted its accounts to us by now.

"A request was received for a further extension but we felt that a sizeable party like the SSP should be able to provide us with this information."

The spokeswoman said that the failure by the SSP to submit its accounts left the commission with two options;


either to impose a fine ranging from £500 to £5,000

or to pass the matter onto the police, which could result in charges being brought against party treasurer Allison Kane
The commission spokeswoman added: "Obviously we would not want to contact the police at this stage, but we will wait to receive the accounts before deciding what action to take."

A fine would be a further financial blow to the party which was expected to be £200,000 in the red by the end of the last financial year.

 MISSED DEADLINE - EXAMPLE PARTIES
Single Issues Party
Social Justice Party
Warwick Residents' Association
Six Towns Independent Group
Civilisation Party
Bristolian
Devizes Guardians
Tommy Sheridan and Rosemary Byrne, a fellow SSP MSP, have previously had to take out personal loans to help the party.

Four of the six Socialist MSPs are currently banned from the Scottish Parliament for a month after staging an in-house protest.

They claimed Holyrood had failed to recognise the right of people to protest at the G8 summit.

It has been estimated that the ban, which also includes the suspension of salaries and allowances, could cost the party about £25,000.

The commission revealed that 70 political parties throughout the UK had failed to meet the accounts deadline.

However, most of those listed are small organisations without political representation in parliaments or councils.

They include Hull Independents, the Northern Progress Party, People's Independent Party 2002 and the Unrepresented Peoples Party.

[Andy Bowden]

We got an extension on the audit thing BTW comrades, so we're okay for now :)

[OUTOFTHENIGHT]

Anyway, going back to the original question , is the adventure in its death agony , I would say the answer is yes!!

[Andy Bowden]

3000 members, a trade union affiliation and 6 MSP's are not going to dissappear because of a poor election result....

[OUTOFTHENIGHT]

.........Yes but can you afford it? Expensive business ,elections, especially when you are a tiny sect........